Is AI driving deeper connections, or just more noise?
In this episode, I’m joined by Nathalie Doremieux, Co-Founder of Podcast LeadFlow, who reveals how to transform podcast listeners into qualified leads through strategic AI-powered conversations. We unpack how the Human → AI → Human model outperforms generic automation, and why quality, not quantity is the future of podcast monetization.
From membership site mastery to funnel strategy that doesn’t sacrifice humanity, Nathalie breaks down what most agency owners are missing and how to fix it.
🎯 Topics we dig into:
- What most podcasters are getting wrong about ROI
- How to train AI to think like you using context and prompts
- The future of lead gen through audio: Podcast LeadFlow’s approach
- Moving from passive listeners to high-intent leads
- Why personalization scales better than spam
🔗 Learn more about Podcast LeadFlow: https://podcastleadflow.com
👋 Say hi to Nathalie: https://www.linkedin.com/in/nathaliedoremieux/
🚨 Subscribe for more: https://isanythingrealinpaidadvertising.adamwbarney.com
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All right, welcome back to Is Anything Real
00:00:08
In Paid Advertising?
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The show where agency founders unpack
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what's real and what's just noise.
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I'm your host, Adam W.
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Barney, and today we've got someone who knows how
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to use AI to spark real human conversations.
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Nathalie, welcome.
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Before we dive into the world
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of podcast engagement, Quick pulse check:
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Is AI actually creating more connection
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or is it just more noise?
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Great question.
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Thank you so much for having me, Adam.
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I, would say both. Right?
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It really depends how you use it.
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It is certainly creating noise and
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keeping a lot of people busy.
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Now, is that very efficient in getting anywhere?
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Maybe, maybe not.
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But, for sure, AI is also, an accelerator of results.
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It's a way to automate, but in a way that is
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not, robotic, I would say, because it can be highly customized.
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That's the power AI is really taking
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automation to a next level and making automations
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that we were doing before more human. I love it.
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And especially when we think about from
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a paid advertising perspective, there's an impact
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there to think about as well.
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I know from your background, and of course
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I would love our audience to dive into
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your background ahead of creating podcast lead flow.
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But you've been building membership sites for
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top entrepreneurs for over 20 years.
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This, new podcast lead flow tool is next level.
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How would you explain the origin story?
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Oh, yeah, absolutely.
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So the background is in software engineering.
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I run this business with
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my husband and business partner.
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We've been in business for 20 years like
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you said, and we've been building membership sites.
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We are behind big platforms like Motorbike, Takimok,
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these, big, online programs.
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And one of the things that we noticed.
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So my husband, with the tech
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and the AI, you know, behind the business,
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really identified an opportunity to use AI to
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bridge a gap between podcasts, listeners, and clients.
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So what I did, about over a year ago now,
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I talked to 100 podcasters because we wanted to look
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at the market and what the needs were.
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And what I found is that most podcasters have
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no idea what that podcast bring to their business.
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That means they are basically hobbyist, right?
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Because they do it because they love it.
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Somehow, you know, it's working.
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You know, like they get great guests
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sometimes and then they have clients.
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But there is nothing strategic about how do I
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run, how do I promote my podcast, what do
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I sell my podcast, what guests do I bring
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in my podcast that can lead to more clients.
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So it's a loss opportunity, basically. Right.
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So as it was, looking into AI was like, well,
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there is an opportunity because what does AI need?
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And we're going to talk about this and we're going
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to come back to this, I'm, sure several times.
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AI is only as good as the knowledge
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and the context that you give it. Right.
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So in the concept of podcasts, what can we do?
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Well, the knowledge is in a podcast episode.
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The context could be asking people, where are they at?
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When you combine the two with a strong AI
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prompt, then you can get a unique output for
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every single listener, who is actually interested.
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From getting from a passive listener, into somebody
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who's taking action for the next step.
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I love that because my background, of
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course, comes from 20 years of digital
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marketing, performance marketing, where everything's trackable.
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And even over that history, you know, you've seen how,
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one of my last jobs, we bought a billboard that
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was across the street from the headquarters and you could
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even track the eyeball engagement with that billboard.
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Or you can use tools, you know, in elevators.
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Captivate here, at least in the
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U.S. is one of the biggest.
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It's a captured market, you can really target it.
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Podcast is the next framework.
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It's not just about getting the
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advertisers on the podcast, right?
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That's one thing I think people have focused on
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in the space for a long, long time is
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how do you get the right advertisers.
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But there's a deeper level
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of data that's, that's available.
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I also think that one of the limitations as we
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use tools like ChatGPT and Claude is the fact
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that although you can speak into them, you, they don't
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actually hear the tone of your voice.
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There's no understanding of the tone of voice.
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It's simply a transcription.
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So when you landed on the human > AI > human framework,
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why is that the secret to real results instead of
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just the generic automation of getting podcasts out
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in the world, or how does that operate?
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basically the whole idea around again, using AI
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is as an accelerator, as an amplifier, right?
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It has this way of, using, being able to quickly
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analyze knowledge and come up with an output, right?
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So the output is only going to
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be as good as what you feed it.
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Like I said, right?
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So that's why going to ChatGPT
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you said, it's lacking context, right?
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It's lacking context.
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And if you ask it to go, if
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you click on the little search, like network
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search, then it's going to pull data from
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different places which might have different opinions.
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Right.
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So if you want to have a good
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experience with AI, you have to be able
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to control where it looks at the knowledge.
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Right?
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so I guess that's a good opportunity to get
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into the tool itself in a little bit more detail
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no trade secrets to share, of course, here.
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But I understand, you know how Podcast
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LeadFlow pull pulls content from episodes
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and turns it into conversation starters.
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What's the next level of how that works?
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basically the way it
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works is actually incredibly easy. Right?
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I think we like, we all like
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things that are incredibly easy as well. Right?
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So let me break it down to you.
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If you choose, if you pick an episode
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that has high value and that is actionable,
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what Podcast LeadFlow is going to do?
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It's the equivalent of having someone next to you that
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has listened to your podcast and, wants to find out,
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how do I implement this, how do I go next?
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You would ask them a couple of questions.
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They are next to you.
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You ask them a couple of questions to
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get context based on what they tell you.
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You give them a piece of coaching, a piece
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of feedback, the next thing to focus on.
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This is exactly what Podcast LeadFlow does with AI.
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The way that it works is for a specific
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episode that has some key knowledge, either a framework
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or something that's actionable that they can do.
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Podcast LeadFlow automatically is going to pull one,
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two, three questions that it could ask the listener
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to help the listener, implement or get their next
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step on how to implement or work on this.
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It's incredible.
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And Podcast LeadFlow is also automatically creating the
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form and automatically coming up with the prompt, which
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means that in a couple of minutes for one
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episode, you've got a couple of clicks, you've got
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a form that you can test.
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So everything by default is generated by AI.
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The questions that it pulls, the output.
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Now you can go back because we are human, right? Human.
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AI human.
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So human come back into play.
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You look at the questions that I came
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up with and remember, they came up with
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the question solely from the, the transcript.
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So the more value you bring
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into the episode, the better. Right? The questions.
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And the prompt is going to be from these questions.
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You can change them.
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We have clients that actually add questions.
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So you might think, well, less people
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are going to fill out the form.
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But the problem is not the problem.
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The key is here.
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It's not volume, it's quality.
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The people that have the pain, and that want to
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get to the next step will answer the questions.
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If they get a Unique email response, right.
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Based on what they shared with you. I love it.
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What kind of results are you
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seeing in bridging that podcast traffic
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between the meaningful connection, the context.
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What are your clients seeing these days?
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What are the biggest wins?
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The biggest wins is we have one, client
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that is a leadership coach and we.
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She was just talking to you, at a conference, right?
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And she.
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So what we do as well is so we create a
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page that has the player and the form and everything, and
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we create a QR code so that she basically on a
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presentation she shared with a QR code, the form, right.
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So you can do your speech. Right.
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And then you can say, I have this really
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cool tool for you to take the next step.
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And a whole, presentation was about
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what is your big assumption?
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And so she did that.
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So what happened is that at, the conference she
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had 35 people, right from when she did on
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stage actually scan, the thing and get into our
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system and get this customized, unique, like.
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So it sounds like your big assumption could be.
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And then she was able to lay out
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a whole framework which is called Edge, where
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she really, she, not she, the AI. Right.
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The prompt really took every
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single answer to the questions.
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And so when you read the email you're like,
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oh my gosh, how much time did it take
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her to actually create something so comprehensive and that
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looks so much like me and what I shared.
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So it not only builds trust and it feels so
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human because it is very human at the core.
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It's all human at the knowledge level
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and it's all human at, the questions. Right.
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And a framework and things like that.
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And so they're getting this personalized email right?
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Through their personal email.
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And the coach is CC'd on the email.
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That means that in a couple of days
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she can say, hey, what did you think? Yeah.
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And then she can have her own flow if it's
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like, do you want to book a call, hit reply
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and ask more questions, you know, whatever your flow is.
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So whatever the call to action might be.
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So this is really a, it's
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a conversation magnet, if you will.
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It's an opportunity to really go, like we were saying,
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from passive to active and getting into a conversation.
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But via email, it's not like, book a call, let's talk.
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It's something where the listener still has
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a lot of control over that connection.
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That's what we're seeing.
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It was just this weekend.
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Wow.
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It's incredible what you're pulling together through this tool
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that brings together knowledge, context and the Prompt to
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build that, more broadly, where do you see this
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kind of personalized engagement heading next?
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Because I've seen it time and
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time again, and especially the paid
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advertising space, that personalization is key.
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But I'm thinking in the realm of
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not just for podcasters, but for anyone
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who's running a funnel for their business. Absolutely.
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So I think like now, I think we're still in this
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space with AI where there are like so many tools that
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come, some die, some come back, you know, new models.
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So I mean it's a full time job
00:13:06
to try to keep up with all this. Right.
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Which is something that I chose not to do because I
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don't think it's productive, you know, for what I want.
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So I always see AI as, how can I solve a problem?
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So I have a problem.
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Is there an AI tool that can help me solve it?
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Can you help me save
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time, do something more consistently? Right.
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Hence the automation without losing the personal touch.
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And that is something, you know, that really
00:13:39
ties into what our business has been because
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we build membership sites for people that want
00:13:45
to really scale without losing the personal connection.
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That's really our tagline, like we want to
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stay human, but we want to scale.
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How do we do that?
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So where I see this going is that, you
00:13:57
know, we've been building AI, you know, like in
00:14:00
the back end for like five, six years. Right.
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So it's not something that somebody that is not a developer
00:14:06
is going to be able to pick up like that. Right.
00:14:08
However, I think that people are going to start
00:14:10
to realize, if they haven't already, that the plain
00:14:15
AI is really not providing great results. Right.
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For, you know, for these type of things.
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And now it's about how we're going to use AI strategically,
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you know, in a bit smarter way with the models that
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we are seeing, are you seeing now the models that are
00:14:34
more and more thinking and analytical and this is all coming
00:14:38
because they are realizing that we need more. Right.
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So this is going to evolve, but I think there's going to
00:14:44
be more and more tools that are going to allow you to
00:14:48
bring back the human aspect and, and we're happy to be among
00:14:54
the, the first ones to do that, which is hard.
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It is hard to be people and, and, and
00:15:01
yeah, so it's that's where I see it happening.
00:15:04
It's like taking, it's like taking the, the initial
00:15:07
unprompted stuff that comes out of any of these
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AI tools is just the vanilla ice cream. Right.
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For, for lack of a better way to describe it.
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And then these tools allow you to layer on the
00:15:18
hot fudge, the sprinkles, the whipped cream, and put the
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cherry on top so that they come back again through
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that, that human to AI to human, across that bridge
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to the other side, and it's fully dressed up and
00:15:32
ready to go in mindset possible.
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And it's really at, the core, what it is going to
00:15:39
do is it's going to accelerate, allow us to better automate.
00:15:46
So we're going to be able to do more. Right?
00:15:48
We can do more now of this conversation.
00:15:51
You know, it doesn't have to be like a, one
00:15:54
you pick them up, of course, you know, afterwards.
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But like all this now can be automated and
00:15:59
still be very much with a human touch. Right.
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Same thing with this automation.
00:16:05
So it's going to allow people to get results faster.
00:16:09
I love it.
00:16:10
That's how I see it.
00:16:13
And I know that you and your husband here are
00:16:17
at the forefront with podcast leadflow, but maybe for
00:16:20
our listeners who are some of the other names or
00:16:23
companies out there that are doing this really well, just
00:16:26
like you are, that are turning, whether it's content into
00:16:29
real thoughtful conversations or just evolving in the AI space,
00:16:35
maybe not three steps ahead of everywhere everyone else is,
00:16:38
but a step and a half or two steps ahead
00:16:40
of where everyone else is.
00:16:41
Well, to be completely honest, we've been kind
00:16:44
of like diving into our own thing.
00:16:46
This really launched in January only. Right.
00:16:48
So it's still very early.
00:16:50
And honestly, I, have yet to find
00:16:53
someone who is actually starting from scratch
00:16:56
and not integrating with existing tools.
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You know, so what we see is a lot of
00:17:02
people using make or other tools to make other AI.
00:17:07
You know, and create these automated funnels, which
00:17:10
I understand the value where we decided to
00:17:13
go is to solve a specific problem.
00:17:16
So right now we are solving the problem.
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And we have podcast leadflow,
00:17:20
but we have video leadflow.
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So we have the same concept for YouTube,
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the same concept for webinars, because webinars have
00:17:29
a ton of value as well. Right.
00:17:31
All right, so it's about how do I repurpose,
00:17:34
you know, in a way, this great content that
00:17:37
I have and get people interested to start taking
00:17:41
action and conversation is where it's at.
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It's the, the quickest way to build trust and
00:17:49
to also get people on your
00:17:52
funnel, because then they can be added into your CRM
00:17:55
and go into your, you know, existing funnel.
00:17:58
So, Yeah, that's incredible.
00:18:03
Natalie, where can people learn more about
00:18:05
podcast LeadFlow and see it in action?
00:18:08
Yeah, well, they can go to podcastleadflow.com and there is
00:18:12
a tab that's called Demo where you can go and
00:18:15
there is a short video on, on how this works.
00:18:20
What we do as well, because it's really literally a couple
00:18:23
of clicks is, we can do like, what we do.
00:18:27
Like when I talk to someone and they are
00:18:29
interested, we'll do a demo on their own episode.
00:18:32
It's that simple that we can do that right now.
00:18:35
What we're doing right now is we're
00:18:37
getting as, many eyeballs on this.
00:18:40
So that's why I'm so excited that you
00:18:42
asked me if I wanted to come.
00:18:44
Because, this is new.
00:18:47
So we need to show you people how. It's amazing.
00:18:50
But people also don't know what they don't know.
00:18:52
They don't. They.
00:18:54
A lot of people think that podcast is just
00:18:57
what it is and they look at their downloads.
00:18:59
Downloads mean nothing, right?
00:19:03
You know, I was just on an episode,
00:19:05
on a podcast that doesn't have a lot
00:19:08
of download, but I really like the guy.
00:19:10
So I went on the episode, I got a call,
00:19:13
booked, and I got a client sign and paid.
00:19:15
He actually paid money.
00:19:17
So it's not quantity, it's quality, guys.
00:19:21
And that's a good thing.
00:19:22
That means we don't have to wait
00:19:24
to have a big list, big downloads.
00:19:26
Downloads mean nothing if they
00:19:28
are not the right people.
00:19:32
What are you going to do with it? Right?
00:19:34
So with this, you are actually
00:19:37
talking to your ideal client, right?
00:19:42
The ideal person that you want to take action.
00:19:45
You can use this for guests as well.
00:19:47
Actually, you know, my, my friend that, and coach
00:19:51
that did the, the that spoke on stage, right?
00:19:57
She recorded the episode that we were going to
00:20:01
put it on with the tool in mind.
00:20:03
So in the episode, she even talks about the tool.
00:20:06
She said, and below this, I have a tool for you.
00:20:11
It's generated by AI with my knowledge.
00:20:14
So she's very open about it because that was important
00:20:17
to her and it's going to tell you what your
00:20:20
big assumption is and we can take it from there. Wow.
00:20:26
I can't wait to test it out myself.
00:20:30
My interest peaked and I can't wait
00:20:31
for the audience to jump on here.
00:20:34
So exciting stuff.
00:20:36
Natalie, thank you for joining us
00:20:37
and talking about Podcast LeadFlow.
00:20:40
Again, this is another episode of
00:20:41
"Is Anything Real in paid Advertising?"
00:20:44
Links to Podcast LeadFlow will be below.
00:20:47
Feel free to connect with Nathalie.
00:20:48
I'm sure she'd be happy to run you through a demo.
00:20:51
And I look forward to joining you next time.
00:20:52
Nathalie, thank you for joining today.
00:20:55
Thanks so much for having me, Adam.
00:20:58
Bye.